Good first pistol?

[Dave]

Originally Posted by Gas Man

I carry a Glock 23. And then some.

My newest piece I'm in love with is the Ruger LCP with crimson trace laser sight, and Recluse Pocket holster





Night sights are useless.

If you are serious about shooting

Crimson Trace



The best part about Glocks is that they are virtually industrutable.

See the Torture Test



No Crimson Trace. Trust me. I will make you a believer... just wait till we go to the range.




True. Plus you can interchage all the glock parts between guns. NO worry about the gun being finicky like some guns get.

what range do you have the ct's set to? They are an issue item overseas and while they work great as a deterrant and as a finger trainer ive always felt that the offset design comprimised it for real world shooting. For most tactical situations id rather have tritium. Wont burn my night eyes and wont give away my position. 'Course itd be best to have both..

[Dave]

Originally Posted by Rider

Accuracy lies 99.9% within the shooter and varies from individual gun. What is accurate for you may not be accurate for others for various reasons including hand size, grip strength and breathing technique.

dont forget hand strength! working out with a gripper can do wonders for your accuracy.

[wildchild]

Originally Posted by Rider

Accuracy lies 99.9% within the shooter and varies from individual gun. What is accurate for you may not be accurate for others for various reasons including hand size, grip strength and breathing technique.

that is very true, but the tool you use also has it's own parameters of accuracy. i can easily bang 3 inch groups with a sigma at 25 yards and many people can't. just wondering about the gun itself, i already know my limits. if you have a gun with a bent barrel you can eventually shoot it accurately as a shooter but it doesn't change the fact that the gun itself is still a piece of shit.

i assume the glock would be easier to shoot accurately as it's trigger pull is half or even less then that of my 9mm.

[Rider]

Originally Posted by wildchild

that is very true, but the tool you use also has it's own parameters of accuracy. i can easily bang 3 inch groups with a sigma at 25 yards and many people can't. just wondering about the gun itself, i already know my limits. if you have a gun with a bent barrel you can eventually shoot it accurately as a shooter but it doesn't change the fact that the gun itself is still a piece of shit.

i assume the glock would be easier to shoot accurately as it's trigger pull is half or even less then that of my 9mm.

Ok put it this way, if it comes down to needing it, it's accurate enough to kill. Most guns that are fired for self defense are fired at distances less than 5 yards away. Even the biggest POS with fixed sights will hit somebody at that range. Ever better with adjustable sights. The bottom line is, buy what is the most comfortable for you to hold and shoot. Brand X may be the most accurate gun in the word but it doesn't mean I'm going to be accurate with it if it doesn't "fit" me.

[wildchild]

rider i totally understand and agree with everything you are saying, but, what i'm wondering is this.

how accurate can the glock 23 be shot by an average person off the shelf.
what does that mean, the average shooter goes to the range 2-3 times a month, not law enforcement, just a shooter. pick it up, line up the sights, control breathing and bang. bullseye? on the paper? or who the hell knows where it went?
the fact is you will need it for self defense maybe once in your lifetime if at all. the rest of the time you go to the range and punch holes in paper. i prefer to shoot at 25 yards. yes i do some rapid fire exercise but most is controlled fire for grouping. some guns cannot do this no matter how well you shoot, some guns excel at it.

yes of course the gun must fit your hand, it must "come up" as a reflex without repositioning, the trigger must be easily acquired by your finger. that i can get from holding one in a shop. i have and they fit well.
what i was asking is in Gasman's opinion is it one of the more accurate firearms available in that caliber for that price point.
a bonus would be how easily is it taken down for cleaning, assembled, reliability, etc. just opinions from someone who owns one.

[Rider]

Originally Posted by wildchild

rider i totally understand and agree with everything you are saying, but, what i'm wondering is this.

how accurate can the glock 23 be shot by an average person off the shelf.
what does that mean, the average shooter goes to the range 2-3 times a month, not law enforcement, just a shooter. pick it up, line up the sights, control breathing and bang. bullseye? on the paper? or who the hell knows where it went?
the fact is you will need it for self defense maybe once in your lifetime if at all. the rest of the time you go to the range and punch holes in paper. i prefer to shoot at 25 yards. yes i do some rapid fire exercise but most is controlled fire for grouping. some guns cannot do this no matter how well you shoot, some guns excel at it.

yes of course the gun must fit your hand, it must "come up" as a reflex without repositioning, the trigger must be easily acquired by your finger. that i can get from holding one in a shop. i have and they fit well.
what i was asking is in Gasman's opinion is it one of the more accurate firearms available in that caliber for that price point.
a bonus would be how easily is it taken down for cleaning, assembled, reliability, etc. just opinions from someone who owns one.

I don't own a Glock but I have put a few boxes through a 23. On the same day I fired a few boxes through a S&W M&P 40 and and the M&P was more accurate for ME, but yes the Glock is accurate right out of the box. The Glock even had a laser sight on it and I was still more accurate with the M&P without laser sight. Go to a gun range where you can rent them. The only way to really answer your question is to fire one.

[Cutty72]

Glocks have "average" accuracy for the "average" shooter, XD's are the same.
Sigs are generally slightly more accurate for the "average" shooter.

For me, both the glock and the sig are not accurate, the XD is pretty good.
Why?
XD is the only one that fits comfortable in my hand.

Another example.
On the Army pistol qualification, you are given 40 rounds, with 4 different shooting positions at 25 yards. I fired a 28 with the M-9 Beretta.
Same qualification, my XD, I fired a 36.

It really is all about how it fits in your hand.

[ericr]

Originally Posted by Dave

For most tactical situations id rather have tritium. Wont burn my night eyes and wont give away my position. 'Course itd be best to have both..

Exactly! Just like tracer ammo in combat...works both ways I've never felt a need for a laser sight. Under 7 yrds where 80% of self defense shootings take place I can hit center mass with both eyes open not using sights, all day long. I fired perfect scores twice qualifying on the M9 in the AF and shot expert every time I qualified.

Wildchild, handgun accuracy is a lot like riding a bike. Put 10 different people on the same bike and you'll get 10 different results in how well they can use it. Accuracy in any modern pistol made by any quality manufacture is all anyone needs for everyday use. Learning to shoot it that well is the trick. That's just training and practice.

[CasterTroy]

Originally Posted by ericr

Exactly! Just like tracer ammo in combat...

I like to load a tracer round 3 from the bottom of my assault rifle mags to let me know when I'm getting close to the end of the mag

[Dave]

Originally Posted by CasterTroy

I like to load a tracer round 3 from the bottom of my assault rifle mags to let me know when I'm getting close to the end of the mag

meh, a lot of times you wont notice due to ambient light and the bullet speed. I found it was easier to learn the difference in recoil and report when the bolt locks back and program the swap into muscle memory